[PnP] Elemental Arts...

Burton Choinski bchoinski at comcast.net
Wed Sep 30 12:17:43 CEST 2009

The pacts they have made with the gnome are only good for about a  
month.  They have to pay a "premium" for longer periods (10% per  
additional month).

On Sep 30, 2009, at 2:30 AM, Scott Adams wrote:

> So how do you treat the pact though.  Does it last forever or do you  
> cast elemental powers to reform teh pact each time?
> At 09:25 PM 9/28/09, you wrote:
>> In the game I am doing right now the players have managed to get the
>> "signature" of a gnome of some measure, after helping an Air
>> elemental.  When they summon for him they use their "key", and still
>> roll against his MDV (he may be "busy").  If they do otherwise, it's
>> just some mook elemental summoned for a short-term spell task.
>> Since they have the contact, they can parlay with the gnome and have
>> contracted out earth elemental help for their new kingdom in the  
>> Elder
>> mountains.  Granted, I think I have to review the "price" in goods  
>> the
>> Gnome have been charging them (it's working out that the gnomes are
>> like union bosses so far in my game -- I'll have to see about finding
>> a different "flavor" for the other top elementals), but once they
>> summon their contact, they do influence type rolls to make their  
>> deals
>> for longer term contracts and numbers.
>> As an example for the last game, they contracted previously with the
>> Gnome (who I have to name and stat out) and managed to get 1 month
>> contract out, with 100 elementals.  The task was to turn over the
>> hills (uprooting trees and upping rocks, at 2 acres per elemental per
>> day) for their new land in the western elder mountains.  Later on,
>> they contacted again and contracted out some elemental tunneling for
>> their land, and eventually worked up to a big tunneling contract.
>> Over all, they spent nearly 4,000GP in "goods" as bribes/sacrifices  
>> to
>> the gnome for his minions work.
>> Now, I was woking based on something like 2SC per elemental/day in
>> goods as the basic rate, and I may well have been too cheap...when I
>> review my prices it may get real expensive in the future.
>> In terms of the pact, The wizard of the group did the first  
>> summoning,
>> and all influence rolls for haggling the deal had to go through him,
>> since he was the one who did the summons, despite the elf in the  
>> group
>> having the better influence and haggling skill.  Later on they had  
>> the
>> elf do the pact, so he could do the deals, but obviously that cuts  
>> the
>> wizard out on any skill gain there.
>> On Sep 28, 2009, at 7:54 PM, Scott Adams wrote:
>>> At 02:48 AM 9/28/09, Thomas O. Magann Jr. wrote:
>>> Noted.  I agree that casting for practice in terms of summoning
>>> isn't wise from the gods POV.  Why I warn folks beforehand.  One
>>> system of about 30 I run does use summoning and doesn't treat the
>>> pact this way.  I just hope to hear from other GMs.  Thanks.
>>>>> I don't know.   I just don't see the logic in the pact being
>>>>> forever.  I could see if one mage stayed on one lake for his
>>>>> entire life.  But if he moved to diff ocean or went to upper world
>>>>> and came back ..etc.  So I just always figured need to cast EP to
>>>>> reform a current pact.  Why I was hoping other GMs and maybe
>>>>> Richard would comment on this.
>>>>> Hopefully more comments will come.
>>>>> Thanks.
>>>> For the record, I am a GM. many games, including P&P.  Also, other
>>>> sorts of pacts are usually permanent (after all, how many souls
>>>> does one have?)  noparticular  reason for this one to be temporary.
>>>> The spell description defines the Pacts as alliances. Those
>>>> generally last longer than the first time one of the allies needs a
>>>> favor. If not, you've not got a real alliance.
>>>> It's an elemental summoning spell, not a spell to talk to the local
>>>> water spirit/vily. You don't get local beings, you get beings from
>>>> the lower  or upper worlds (or the air above the upper world, if
>>>> you're after an air elemental). That's the core of a summoning:
>>>> contact level creatures only. It's why you can get a water serpent
>>>> at sea but not a lake (well, with the spell, you could always try a
>>>> shout at a lake) .
>>>> Besides, why would a pact end as long as you kept to it? Pay the
>>>> elementals you summon for their inconvenience, don't bother them
>>>> too often, send them home when you're done (after paying, of
>>>> course) and they'll be better disposed to you, not worse. Why would
>>>> they break the pact for good treatment?
>>>> Sit on a ship with  a chest of earth constantly summoning earth
>>>> elemental over the ocean sending them home immediately with no
>>>> payment, day in and day out for weeks just to get better when you
>>>> really need it, well, THAT would be cause to break a pact. Might
>>>> make it hard to reform, too.
>>>> Again, 'permanent' doesn't mean 'forever', like any alliance, it
>>>> means 'until violated'. How many spell casters actually think of
>>>> paying the elementals they summon, after all? For that matter, how
>>>> many human wizards summon elementals that dont' like humans? Most
>>>> elemental entries will tell you what the opinion of the sub race of
>>>> elemental is towards humans, and in many cases a clue as to
>>>> potential payment.
>>>> The players that summons neutral and friendly elementals, rather
>>>> than enemy ones, that offers payment, and that can actually cast a
>>>> strong enough dispel to send it home, and only summons in need, not
>>>> just for practice, has kept to the pact/alliance. No reason to lose
>>>> it. that's the kind of mage/wizard an elemental would prefer to
>>>> deal with. Well, those that like to deal with them at all.
>>>> The 'practice makes perfect' mage, the human that summons
>>>> elementals that hate humanity, so the elemental can serve a human,
>>>> the mage that never even thinks to offer payment... well, that's
>>>> the mage that needs to keep recasting the Pact. Of course, he's
>>>> also the mage that will have the most expertise, simply because he
>>>> casts the spell so much more often.
>>>> Thank you for your time,
>>>> Thomas O. Magann Jr.
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